So...

[trinityofone]

Please tell me some of the rest of y'all have done the naughty and read you-know-what and want to talk about it here. 'Cause I just don't know enough HP people. (And there's something I've never before regretted. ;-) )

ETA: So far, no actual spoilers in the comments. If/when that changes, I promise to edit with the appropriate warning IMMEDIATELY.

ETA2: I would say that there are some spoilers here now! BACK AWAY.

Comments

[trinityofone.livejournal.com]

You didn't need my brilliant an incisive questions?! *shock gasp*

*takes out garbage, contemplates dishes*

[liviapenn.livejournal.com]

There's just so much to say! Hm. By character:

1. Harry

Really did give a sense of being more mature & having grown in this book (as a person and a leader) while still convincingly being seventeen and kind of dumb. Liked that the narrative at least gave a nod to him needing to learn not to rush into things without making a plan or knowing what he's doing, even if that particular bit was executed a bit anviliciously.

2. Ron

Got to be awesome, and have his heroic Joseph Campbell moment in the woods, so that's cool too. There might be people who feel like the "Ron and Harry fight" subplot has been done and is kind of repetitive, here, but I feel like it's more realistic if it's really a constant theme in their friendship that you can't just *fix* by saying "Ron, dude, you're not my funny sidekick, honest," and then Ron never thinks about it again. So I *liked* that it came up again, the way a person's neuroses really do, and I liked that Ron came back, and so on and so forth.

3. Hermione

Really seemed like part of the *team* in this book, which was really cool. *LOVED* that she stuck with Harry instead of going away with Ron just because she's in love with him-- if there's one thing that kind of gets on my nerves about this last book, it's the sort of very subtle way that the female characters are *still* treated a bit differently than the male ones-- like at the end, the son gets teased about *becoming* a Slytherin, but the daughter gets teased about *marrying* one, ARGH. Anyway, there were other bits like that (especially Harry "saving" McGonagall from being spit on, when he'd managed to keep under the Invisibility Cloak under far greater provocation) but I didn't really have a lot to quibble with in terms of *Hermione's* characterization, so that's good. Oh, and I loved that she was the one to initiate her and Ron's first kiss, which I thought was handled well.

4. Snape

Yeah, I still don't like Snape. OK, so he was in love with Lily. It didn't keep him from joining the Death Eaters. OK, so he was actually out to protect Harry all along. Didn't keep him from taking out his sad little grudge against Harry, on all the rest of the Gryffindors. I'm glad he didn't die super-heroically, like, diving in front of a killing curse to save Harry or anything, because then I would have felt like JKR was trying to manipulate me into liking him, and I still don't.

5. The Malfoys

What are we supposed to think about the Malfoys? I mean, didn't Lucius and Narcissa still torture and kill people-- in the original Voldemort era, surely they did, right? They're still Death Eaters, but we're supposed to accept that people wouldn't immediately throw them in the dungeons or something after the fight's over, just because they pussed out at the end and weren't actively killing people in the final battle? Did they end up in Azkaban? What about Draco? I need to re-read that scene where he doesn't positively identify Harry or Hermione... I just don't know what I think about Draco. (Unlike 90% of fandom, I would have liked less Draco redemption. *G*)

[trinityofone.livejournal.com]

1. I actually liked Harry and identified with his problems a lot more in this book than in the others. He wasn't too horribly emo or CAPSLOCK, and I liked his doubt. So, yay.

2. Liked Ron, too. And that his No. 1 fear appears to be Harmonians. ahahahaha. We hear you, man!

3. Hermione is so smart and cool—why does she cry all the time? I mean, she spent the whole book, basically, alternating between being awesome and weeping/sobbing/gasping. I mean, I guess that could be a legitimate character trait, but it really bugged me after a while.

4. I've always felt a lot of sympathy for Snape, and was TOTALLY unsurprised by how his whole plotline played out; I never doubted that he was still spying for Dumbledore, etc. I mostly just wish, as I said below, that we could have SEEN Harry reevaluate his feelings, or even have a moment of, "Yeah, Snape was a dick, but he was brave in the end," instead of suddenly being, "ZOMG SNAPE WAS THE BRAVEST MAN EVAH I SHALL NAME MY CHILD AFTER HIM." Okay!

5. I AM SO FUCKING CONFUSED BY THE MALFOYS. I feel like Rowling never really knew what to do about them, couldn't commit to having them be TOTALLY EVOL! or redeemed, and instead settled for some middle mushy place. Especially Draco. OMG JUST DECIDE. I think I really just wanted him to make a CHOICE, one way or the other, but instead he just skulks along. Maybe that was Rowling's point, but if so, I don't think she sold it strongly enough.

Also, all the switcheroo about the various wands gave me a headache.

[liviapenn.livejournal.com]

Hermione is so smart and cool—why does she cry all the time? I mean, she spent the whole book, basically, alternating between being awesome and weeping/sobbing/gasping. I mean, I guess that could be a legitimate character trait, but it really bugged me after a while.

Hm, I didn't really notice that, but maybe it will jump out at me on a re-read. I felt like Harry cried a bit, too.

I've always felt a lot of sympathy for Snape, and was TOTALLY unsurprised by how his whole plotline played out; I never doubted that he was still spying for Dumbledore, etc.

*nodding* Oh, yeah, totally unsurprised there. I mean, who didn't know he was in love with Lily, etc.

Actually, my issue with Snape is the same as my problem with the Malfoys, I guess. OK, so Snape loved Lily and the Malfoys love their son-- BIG DEAL. That doesn't actually make you a hero-- it doesn't automatically redeem you if you've done horrible awful things. "Yes, I killed some helpless Muggles, and had many other harmless witches and wizards sent to Azkaban to be tortured, and was basically a child-murdering Nazi... but I love my son, Draco." Er what? Are we supposed to find that touching? Or surprising somehow?

I think it's an interesting thing to put in a kids' book-- "Even bad people are capable of love, see!" But I don't really like it if the lesson is "and that automatically means more than all their bad choices, so all you have to do is be like 'I love my cat' and that's *good enough*-- you don't actually have to DO anything to be redeemed, like actually try to stop bad things from happening, or actively help people, or protect the helpless, or try to make it up to the people that you hurt." I mean, look at Dumbledore, who spent his whole life in penance for being a teenage git. I mean, obvs Snape *did* work for the cause of good, but the Malfoys (the Malfoys senior, anyway) not so much-- they were pretty much selfish and cowardly to the end.

I think I really just wanted him to make a CHOICE, one way or the other, but instead he just skulks along. Maybe that was Rowling's point, but if so, I don't think she sold it strongly enough.

Yeah, agreed. I mean, you know there are people who will be like "See! Draco, totally redeemed!" but... I would have liked to see him actually do something *inarguably* unselfish first.

[liviapenn.livejournal.com]

6. Dumbledore

I like that JRK addressed the whole "hey, Dumbledore is kind of sketchy" argument. Also, Dumbledore/Grindenwald, HOT NEW SLASH PAIRING, just angsty and fascist and pretty enough for fandom to completely latch onto. Woot.

7. People who died

Man, a lot more people died than I thought would, and although I was horrified and saddened by each one, I'm not *shocked* by any of them, really. I mean, you had to figure at least one Weasley would die, and Ron and Ginny aren't expendable, so it was probably going to be Percy or one of the twins. Remus had to die because he was one of Harry's father figures, although I *am* surprised that JKR killed off Tonks too. Snape, similarly-- ever since he killed Dumbledore, he was marked. But, at least she didn't kill off Luna or Neville, which would have been HORRIBLE.

8. Nineteen Years Later

(OK, so Nineteen Years Later isn't a character, what do you want from me?)

I sense a lot of "I'm ignoring the epilogue" fic in the works. Actually, I predict that within a week of the book's release there will be some apt fannish wordsmush or portmaneau to indicate that your fic or your personal canon is Deathly Hallows-compliant but ignores the epilogue. Oh, and Teddy Lupin / Victoire Weasley is my new favorite pairing. Come on, you know they're both HAWT. I see Teddy as being kind of Byronic and *attractively* broody in that way that Harry never quite managed, and of course Victoire has Fleur's veela charm crossed with Bill's scruffy rock-star sex appeal. I have decided that they're both archaeologists, and they go around having adventures like Rick and Evie in "The Mummy." ... Yeah. Um, I basically just wanted to say something that wasn't "stop naming the kids like an ff.net writer would" because everyone is already saying that and is GOING to be saying that. Because, seriously, JK, no.

[trinityofone.livejournal.com]

6. I like that JRK addressed the whole "hey, Dumbledore is kind of sketchy" argument

Yeah, there was even Rita Skeeter's suggestion of NAMBLA-pandy. Heh.

(And speaking of possibly inadvertently funny things—I LOVED the conversation where Hermione basically says that it's not the size of the wand that counts, it's what you do with it that matters. *g*)

7. I'm really, REALLY glad that Neville and Luna lived (though Neville/Luna is actually one ship I would have enjoyed hearing about in the epilogue, complete with unfortunate children's names). I didn't mind, story-wise, the other characters' deaths, although as I said below, I'm sad Remus and Tonks didn't get more of a send-off, and I'm very, very worried about George now. I've been doing a lot of reading about twins lately, and the idea of them being separated makes me ouchy.

8. I am one of the many lame and predictable people who can't get over the names. I think the wave of epilogue-ignoring fic will be amusing to witness, but even more, I'm anxiously awaiting (as an amused spectator) all the people who will now decide it's their mission in life to make the next generation have sex. I loved svmadelyn's poll about "how long till Albus Severus/Scorpius"? Be afraid. Be very afraid! *g*

[liviapenn.livejournal.com]

I don't think you're lame and predictable! I just wanted to have something to say BESIDES "James, Lily and Albus? SRSLY?" Because.... yeah. Srsly?

Poor George. *snifs* He'll be ok, he's got the rest of the family, it's not like he's all alone. Plus, maybe Fred will come back as a ghost or something, how about that! :D